Breaking the Wall

I too agree that both candidates have their flaws, though I would pick Obama over McCain any day simply because McCain scares me and there is no way I would want to risk another draft. If McCain is elected I am most assuredly looking at homes in Canada. I thought about other candidates as well, but in an election that is going to be close, I feel like I'm obligated as a registered liberal to vote Democrat.

Also as a prospective educator I tend to lean toward Democrats' platform with regards to education. Republicans don't appropriate as much $$ into the public school system, and as Bush has shown with his No Child Left Behind Act of 2001, their approach does our kids a gross disservice I think. Another necessary issue to consider is Republican's abstinence only approach to sex education in the U.S. It hasn't been effective and children are still sexually active at the same age if not younger than past generations. We need to teach protection over abstinence simply because most kids outside of faith-based instruction aren't going to adhere to a "not until youre married" approach you know? sorry I'll get off my soapbox. I'd be interested to have a discussion with FRBers though about prospective candidates and who to vote for on election day.

Benn:

The reason it has not been effective is because one class that teaches abstinence cannot win a fight against everything else that teaches promiscuity. And when a school makes students doubt that God exists and there is a law and ultimate accountability, you have no hope against teenage hormones exposed to a barrage of immoral entertainment.

But we must do what is right. Comparing this to drugs - even if the drugs are offered on every corner, we still teach "say no to drugs", we do not teach "sterilize your needle".

See I have thought about the issue a lot especially in my education classes. I battle with issues a lot sitting there. I'm going to have to teach lessons that are essentially going against what I actually believe in. And yet by law I am not allowed to talk about my beliefs in the classroom. I agree with ultimate accountability, yet such a high proportion of our students, especially in urban settings do not prescribe to a religious conviction.

Also, as a history teacher I am going to have to address relevant questions kids have i.e. "Well wait a minute, Mr. Griffin. If Buddhism and Hinduism, and Greek Gods and Goddesses were around a lot longer than Christianity, what gives us the right to say we are the only true religion?"

If there's something I've decided to get around the faith issue, it's the idea that religion or belief in a "higher power" whatever that may be has served as a societal organizer and served to keep in check dissidents. Yet it seems that in the last generation our country has gotten away from the faith issue and has failed to address the radical shift and delinquency that is emerging in our nation's youth. I don't know. There are so many things wrong, but we can't force faith based judgment on others that perhaps might not have yet been exposed to it.

After all, the nation was founded by deists, who believed God kind of took a back seat to governing human will aye?

I like Chuck Balwin too. I'm not in 100% agreement with him on everything, but with enough of the big issues to get my vote. The way I see it, he's the only candidate who's not a socialist.

How is Socialism necessarily a bad thing though? I'd rather everyone be at the same level and achieve success, then the rich continue to grow richer, and the poor poorer. Look at Scandinavians.. they are the happiest people in the world and most are Socialist in structure.

If I succeed, why should I punished? Why can't I freely give the money I earned to those I choose to give it to?

Regarding the Scandinavians, I have not talked to any or read any studies, so I can't comment on that.

One reason this country is so screwed up: capitalism. It's based on the idea of competition, but what ends up happening is that a few make the big bucks, everyone else is screwed and left behind. They say if you work hard enough you can get what you want. It's not true, and then you have everyone "living the American Dream" buying SUVs and houses they can't afford.

Socialism would be better than a capitalist system that results in too many people being left behind.

Same thing is being proposed of education; Republicans want to instate Vouchers, i.e. you get to decide where your tax money goes to which school. What will happen then? Urban city schools will continue to get shafted and suburban schools will continue to profit.

Benn - I used to think EXACTLY as you do. I voted for Nader in 2000, Kerry in 2004. I have definitely become more conservative with age, especially as I get further removed from my idealistic university setting. What really changed me were a couple things: 1) working in the private consulting sector for the last 6 years; 2) recently starting my own business. I've seen first-hand how incompetent the gov't is at administrating our money. That's why they would contract my company to do things: they couldn't do it! The real hope lies in the private sector and in non-profits. Sooo much more efficient. People hire my company because we get stuff done. Then with my home business, I've found out that if I work really really hard, do a good job, treat my clients like kings, then I can actually make money by working in my basement. It's pretty cool, if you have an idea or a skill, you can make a living off it. That is the American Dream. But when I started actually making some money, I really saw how much of it was leaving. And for what? The government will NOT make our lives better; the government will not solve our problems. It's up to us to solve our problems. And yes, it's up to us to give and be charitable as well, and I would much rather trust a good NGO to use my hard-earned money than Bush, Bush II (McCain), or Obama.

Anyway, I totally understand where you are coming from. It is important, our duty, to help the poor and the downtrodden. That is a big issue to me. But I think you and I (the people) can do a better job of that than our federal government.

And by the way, our country is screwed up because of excessive debt, not because of capitalism. Too many people forgot about the "capital" part of the deal.

Mm It's just so frustrating you know? It's like the government doesn't even care about the average person is what I take away from it. And I know that I'm not going to make loads of money. You dont really go into the education field for the money. (or so I'm told ;p). I just want to try to make a difference if I can. I just wish that politicians would work the same way. I don't like even voting for anyone for our state assembly because they went 20+ years without even approving a state budget on time. And now with the current deficit for THIS fiscal year here in NY they go on a 4 week Thanksgiving break?! I swear that politicians work the least of any profession. Even if you work at the 7/11, you don't get a break. In all likelihood they are going to work on holidays w/out even getting overtime or bonus. You know? Grr why is it so frustrating? It seems this country is so dysfunctional.

It's punishment to share the blessing of your success with others? Do you work hard only for yourself, or for your family as well as your community, as well as for your country?

Too many people choose not to give. And too many in need, genuine need, are not chosen to be given to.

If you choose to live in America, I think that means you should choose to help make it a better place.

Capitalism is a great idea. But in actuallity it leads to corruption and a grossly disproportionate distribution of the wealth. No one is proposing anything extreme as a solution. There will always be rich, middle class, and poor. But the weight of the disparity between the classes does not have to fall so heavily on the poorest of the poor. And the wealthiest should not be so begrudging with their advantage.

You go, hon!

yes but what does capitalism breed? greed.

I'm only 22 and I see that. I see my friends from h.s. go to get their jobs and they choose the ones that will make them the most money, not make a difference. Yet I grapple with the issue of how can I take a social justice approach to educating our nation's youth when everything else about a capitalist country preaches ME ME ME.

I appreciate your comments on Sasha's blog concerning the current political nightmare and perspectives we are facing. I tend towards the conservative bent but try to be open minded to the issues I see the candidates address on a policy basis. With that said, Socialism is fine concept if the community/civilization is ready to implement it across the board and fair and even basis. As you point out that capitalism can be taken advantage of by the wealthy and the expense of the poor, implmenting a socialistic approach in our current mindset will result in the poor taking advantage of the wealthy by seeing that individuals can continue to or enhance their ability to bring income in by adding no value to society nor even trying to improve their status. As was mentioned, in Scandnavian countries, socialism is in place and many are happy. But it is not a viable area to attempt to be a small business owner due to the tax structure and HR issues faced to try and get hard workers. Socialism can lead to a grossy disproportionate distribution of the work and value added to society. Too many being left behind could also be caused by too many people looking for others to make my situation better, not by working hard to contribute and achieve success through their own means.

This being said, it is a sad state where the disparity and the perceived "entitlement" that the extreme wealthy are so pronounced and where the rich tend to flaunt their wealth on frivolous things rather than helping out those on whom they depended to help achieve their status. On the flip side, there are many rich influential people who do give generously of their blessings (Wayne Huizenga, Bill Gates, etc.).

Unfortunately this is a complex issue to which there is no one right answer nor one right person can fix alone.

Jeff is much more eloquent than I am. Well said. Part of my views lies with my disillusionment of the competence of the government. While I feel is it our duty to help our fellow man, the feds just don't have a very good track record with acting responsibly. And point taken on some huge companies. Many of them have a poor track record as well. (but not all)

Bill Gates is one of my heroes. He started from scratch, made a product used my millions, became successful, and is now devoting the rest of his life to doing good with his money. B&M Gates Foundation is an organization that gives me some hope.

I didn't say all government is bad, but the politics that drive government are the worst culprit of making government ineffective (disclaimer: this being said since I am a Fed and do try to hard to a steward of the taxpayers money working items of criticial importance for the country. Most if not all government employees I know truly want to do the right thing, at least as much if not more so than the workers for any major corporation do since we obviously aren't in for the money either!)

oops, sorry Jeff, in light of how you put it, what I wrote looks pretty stupid and harsh. Sometimes in the spirit of a good debate, I type things on the fly and don't think it through. ;-) And that apology goes to anyone else who I've offended.

Once again, I agree with Jeff's sentiments on the government vs. politics. I'll shut up now for good.

I voted for Chuck! I don't like either major party these days and think the government has well overstepped its authority. I would love to see more 3rd party candidates actually win to shock the lifelong politicians into realizing that we are tired of the status quo.

Paul- I don't think what you said and what Jeff says contradict each other. Most gov't employees want to do right. But all it takes is some corrupt or unwise (or both) people up top to completely cancel out any good from the average workers. It's just like a war- all the soldiers on the front line may do a good job, but if their general orders them into a cannon fodder situation, it won't matter.

Well see I feel like Obama would be better than nothing because no offense but Chuck has no chance of winning. Even less of a chance than Nader. And it's not going to send a message so I just don't see why it's worth me taking the time to drive to the polling place to vote if it's not going to make a statement. :-

Benn, good for you for doing at least that, I know many folks that aren't even going to vote since they don't think it would make a difference. Apathy and giving up is not the answer either. Everyone...VOTE!

Oh, and Paul, no offense taken. I believe I knew what you were saying and agree with Jon that those at the top are swayed by politics too much that do indeed negate the good that government can do for the people. One word for what is bad in my mind: ENTITLEMENTS!

Well I might not agree with Obama on all issues but the way I figure is this: Either Obama or McCain is going to win and I'm sure as **** not going to let McCain get power. It'll be Bush #3 and I am not going to put up with that. THat's why I've supported Obama. Democrats will give us more money for education and hopefully END THIS GODAWFUL WAR :D

Jeff - good, thanks.

Rock the vote!!

IMHO I think socialism robs people of their motivation to work hard. There is no reason to work hard because everything gets distributed so sparsely that you have no reason to exercise good faith in labor let alone education. I also feel that socialism discourages having a family and although that may be arguable I feel very confident that it discourages large families as does the government in the US tend to more and more.

As an example the more laws we create the more time we spend worrying about staying in compliance of the law or else suffer the consequences. You spend time doing your taxes, keeping your yard to a certain level of neighborhood cleanliness and upkeep, register your vehicles, obtaining a drivers license, getting your children their government mandated shots, educating them according to government standards or else taking them through the school system and meeting a lot of social expectations.

Then many people including myself spend the majority of their work year either earning money to pay taxes or for instance or again providing for the common good. I believe capitalism does breed greed but to encourage idleness but robbing humanity of ability to do better does far worse.

I to believe the election is a farce. In 2000 I voted Libertarian, in 2004 I voted for Bush. In the primaries I voted for Obama and come Election Day I don’t know whom I will vote for. I have McCain who claims he will cut spending (I don’t think any politician actually knows how to do this and I believe this will be our ultimate down fall) and will most likely appoint the Justices that I would like to see on the high court. Or I can vote Obama who will tell me whatever I want to hear so long as he gets elected and will also raise taxes on the top 250K earners nope 200K earners, nope 150K earners, well you get my point he is going to raise taxes on the majority of us because government can spend your money better than you can. This in turn equals less disposable income and equals another tax on the family. After all how much can a one or two family income support.

So now I am left with a a bunch of third party candidates Nader, Baldwin, Barr, personally I would rather have any of them over the top two bring back Ross Perot. Just give me someone who believes in Life, Liberty, and the Pursuit of Happiness. Not tax spend protect constituents i.e. the people to unmotivated to work hard to make progress or the big campaign contributors that want handouts.

All great civilizations are eventually brought down by to many special interests groups be they on the right or the left give it time Washington Insiders will bring us down.

The day my oldest daughter was born I told her life wasn’t fair. I will still stand by that statement although it is an argument for another time. My saddest commentary is I believe most politicians get into politics because the want to make things better but they become corrupted and don’t even know it because of the environment in which they live.

Three words: Ron Paul Revolution.

I think anyone that gets into politics is indeed noble (at least initially). But yeah look at the NYS legislature here. They get their transportation, house, food, etc etc paid for regardless of if they get anything actually DONE. And they make way too much money. What about the teachers that have to perform every single day and are now unindated with the NCLB Act? They get paid crap. Makes me depressed. How can I even afford a family even though my heart lies with teaching?

I guess what I gather from everyone is that it doesn't matter if you don't agree with the mainstream candidates. You should vote for the person that best sums up your feelings of how the country should be run, regardless of whether they are a major or minor contender?

That's what I figure- vote for who you like best, major or minor.

Hmm, I have to agree with Sasha on every point this time.

Jon-So many people that I know have expressed their favor towards Ron Paul. but the Washington political and big media machine washed him right out of existence. He may not be the most charismatic man, but he had some very good SPECIFIC IDEAS. Can't say that about Obama or even Mc Cain. All they can do is attack and go stumping for votes. What a freakin joke this election is....

Sorry, that was a bit strong and opinionated.. but it's how I feel.

I think Ron Paul is great- he clearly states what he believes and ALWAYS votes accordingly, even when he is the ONLY one voting against a bill. Plus, we often try to make politics so complicated, but he can explain very clearly why we are in our current state today and how we can fix everything.

I agree with your last comment, Benn. Go out and vote for who you think is best, regardless of whether they are mainstream or not. A word regaring socialism - there are MANY examples in the history of the world to show us how socialism does not work (and never will!). I served a mission for two years in former east germany, post-wall, post-reunification (1992-1994), and we could still see the results of communism/socialism. The people were downtrodden. There was no motivation to work hard (it was just starting to come back). The economy was stagnant. Why do you think the Soviet Union collapsed? Because communism/socialism does not work in the long run. No, you can't force people to live in equality. By the same token, I don't like how government is deciding when and where the principles of capitalism should be applied. Small business, yup, they can go under if they don't know how to be profitable. Big business, nope, we gotta save them, they are too big to fail. Hah! There is only one way I know of where it all works: the law of consecration. Everyone voluntarily consecrates all their goods, money, etc., and receives back only what they need. But it requires voluntarily living this way. That is the key. No one can be forced to live this way. No one can be forced to give up their money and property. And it requires a lot more than that - it requires a righteous people united in their love for their fellow man (or woman). Sorry for the diatribe. Oh how I wish Romney had won the Republican nomination . . .

Wasn't it George Washington who said that political parties would be the downfall of our country? I think you have to vote for the person you think will do the best and who supports the same things you do.

As for capitalism vs socialism, I don't think either one is evil or unable to work. They both have their pros and cons. It is the inability of us as human beings to make them work.

I do think that if you work hard enough you can live how you want. However, we have such a warped idea of what is successful. You don't have to have a huge house, an SUV, a big screen TV, etc. to be successful or happy. The current credit and housing problems stem from the inability of people to live within their means.

I'm very disappointed with our choices in this election. I believe both major party candidates are saying anything and everything they can in order to be elected. (The political process is too divisive and mean spirited. Is there really only 2 sides to every issue? Republican vs. Democrat?)

I believe that every citizen's vote should count equally, regardless of where they live. (i.e. the Electoral College should be done away with.) It would be so much better if we had say, 10 candidates, all with equal funding, all with equal press coverage, and each one with a fair chance to debate and discuss their views. Then let the people decide who represents them best.

Also, do away with polling. Let everyone vote on election day, count them up, and announce the winner. Why do we have to predict the results ahead of time?

I am for the so-called Ron Paul Revolution. We need to have the ability to vote for a candidate that truly represents our values without the concern that he has no chance of winning. How do we get there?

Easy in America. All you have to do is mark a check box on the ballot. In the Soviet Union people had to face tanks to make their votes count. In 1991 the Communists tried a violent takeover. I remember those couple of days. I sat at home in panic fearing for my life. There were people who did better than that, though. They went into the streets and faced the tanks. Eventually the army began to grasp the horror of having to shoot their own people, this awoke the deep inner sense of right and wrong among the soldiers and their commanders, the army switched sides and the coup was over.

This goes to show the power of one. One person decides to do what's right, and if he persists, others around him do the same.

We have much better opportunities for influencing others without the help of big money than in the past. All of us here would be nearly complete political nobodies a few years ago. Not anybody. You post what you believe in your blog, and several hundred people will read it. It spreads.

A vote according to your true inner beliefs is never a wasted vote. We all need to do it and use the means we've been given to tell others about it.

Everyone needs to vote. My opinion is if you don't vote than you shouldn't be critical who gets in, because obviously by not voting you didn't care.

Somewhere we need a balance between industry and education to get an equal opportunity for everyone. Which candidate that is... I don't know.

Awesome, I voted for Chuck Baldwin as well, so he got at least two votes! I wasn't about to vote for "McBama" and really wanted Ron Paul, so Baldwin got my vote and it was not wasted!

Bet you wish you voted Obama now. He just owned McCain and McBaldwin!

Benn - I don't follow your logic. Obama won't punish us for not voting for him. :P

I agree with Paul, just as we indicted earlier that you should vote your conscience, so should everyone. Just because he won the election doesn't mean everyone should have and those that did should feel bad.

That's one of the reasons that I don't like the polls. I know people who change their votes based on who they think will win - they want to be part of the winner's camp, even if they have no idea what the winner wants to do.

I agree with that. The election isn't like a football game- our team is better than your team ha ha ha- and it isn't like you get special points for voting for the winner. It's one country. Why try to shove it in your neighbor's face because he voted for someone he agreed with or you disagreed with? That's where all the divisiveness comes in that both big parties were trying "so hard" to mend. Everybody screaming for "change" but still shove it in the "losers'" faces, and the "losers" act as if rebellion against the inevitable is the best option.

I don't really care for Obama, but he's the president-elect and as such I'll respect it. I don't need to drive around with a bumper sticker that says "not my president" on it. He will be the president of our country, period. When the next election comes around I'll vote for somebody else I agree with, and respect the people who want to re-elect Obama's choice just as much. It's sad to blame or accuse the parties or their leaders for all the problems and divisions in America, when so much of it comes down the decisions, choices, and attitudes of the American public.